Punk-rock fan, public-access TV host, and vegan activist, Isa Chandra Moskowitz is the author of the cookbooks Vegan with a Vengeance and Vegan Cupcakes Take Over the World. Her irreverent attitude and cooking skills have won her fans beyond the world of dedicated vegans. Moskowitz’s new book, Veganomicon: The Ultimate Vegan Cookbook, is due out in November.
How are your plans for vegan world domination going?
It’s been pretty smooth sailing for us so far. I mean, in life there’s always the guy with the “People Eating Tasty Animals” hat. But people have been really receptive. No one can resist a cupcake.
It’s a pretty good Trojan horse.
Yeah, and people are reporting that they’ve had luck getting bakeries to bake the cupcakes. I’m always a little surprised when people love the cupcakes, just because I’m used to a life of people being so resistant to vegan food. But I think the mindset of people is changing.
Meat consumption is up, they say, but it seems people are becoming more and more vegan-friendly. If you were vegan 10 years ago, you know — you can just look around the supermarket and see how much things have changed.
Back then, people didn’t even know what the word “vegan” meant. Now they just say, “I could never be vegan, because I could never give up cheese.” At least now people know what the word means.
Exactly. And sometimes they even pronounce it correctly.
So, have you found any good vegan cheese?
No, and I was writing about that just today — that the single most important activist thing we could do is invent a good vegan cheese. If someone’s receptive to veganism, but they don’t feel like they can do it, it always is, “But I love how this or that tastes!” And it seems like as much as they’ll agree with you about the ethical arguments, their own taste preferences win out.
But I remember the anecdote in Vegan with a Vengeance about your knishes, where everyone loved them until they found out they were vegan.
Since I’ve become as famous as a vegan chef can become, people act differently about my food. They’ll eat it because they know that the New York Times wrote about me, so they want to eat it. And then it doesn’t matter what’s in it.
Why do you think the image of vegans as joyless ascetics who settle for lousy food is so persistent?
I think partly just because it’s convenient to think that way, to say, “I met a vegan once and they were really annoying, so I’m going to drink milk.”
I don’t think we have a PR problem; I think the rest of the world has an animal-abuse problem. I think leading by example is the best thing to do. Just living your life as a vegan, showing people that it isn’t soooo hard.
There are so many forms of activism that I can’t really say that this or that is the most effective. My focus is on getting vegan food out there, because the biggest stumbling point for so many people is that it isn’t as convenient as they would like it to be.
I also think that it’s important to present veganism as something no one is perfect at. When I talk about veganism, I don’t start off with, “No honey, no whey, no isinglass” or what have you. I start off with “Avoid eggs and dairy. The rest will come.” But that’s just me.
There are people who just think vegans are judgmental and preachy, whether or not they’ve ever met one. Then there are people who think vegans are stoic martyrs who are suffering for a cause. Those are the people who are like, “I respect what you’re doing, but I could never do that!”
But for most vegans, it’s easy to eat the way that we do. There are always challenges, especially at first, but you live and learn and do your best.
How do you respond to people who refuse to question their own eating habits?
If I’ve exhausted all my resources, the usual arguments — ethical ones, environmental ones — and the person doesn’t want to change, I just walk away from it. I mean, what can you do, short of setting yourself on fire and slapping a cheeseburger out of their hand?
I have friends that eat meat and I love them, but I think that they’re doing something that isn’t right. I can’t make sweeping generalizations about all meat-eaters. I was one once.
Do you see yourself as a partisan in a larger battle? I’m thinking about all of the anti-vegan stuff I’ve seen over the years, the Anthony Bourdains of the world who detest vegans.
Are you asking, would I like to fight Anthony Bourdain?
Yes, I am.
I would love a steel-cage match with Anthony Bourdain.
What recipes from any of your books would be most likely to convert someone to veganism?
The recipe for giving up some power and starting to care about the world. Or maybe the recipes for French toast, tempeh bacon, and scrambled tofu.
Seattle-based Ben Grossblatt is a writer, an editor of children’s books, and a longtime vegan.
The Culinate Interview | |
| We talk with people doing influential, important, or just plain unusual work in food. | |
Want more? Comb the archives.
| | Making meaty filmsMore-than-a-dream projectA campaign to bring meat know-how online. |
Local FlavorsThe beauty of breadcrumbsCherish the humble crumb | The Produce DiariesChia seedsThe latest superfood |
First PersonDinner of a lifetimeA changed man | OpinionThe evolution of fresh foodBack to the land — or at least to the farmers’ market |
There are 10 comments on this item
Add a comment
1. by Holly on Jul 3, 2007 at 6:13 PM PDT
Bourdain’s book A Cook’s Tour was even more pointed. He pointed out that in many parts of the world, a chicken is the difference between life and death, that only the wealthy and privileged can afford to eat vegan, and it’s just plain elitism to insist that the whole world give up animal products. I have to say I agree with him.
2. by anonymous on Jul 3, 2007 at 8:51 PM PDT
Holly, sure, we can only do what we can do. But that’s not a legitimate excuse for those of us who aren’t in that position - probably almost anyone with a weblog, right?
3. by elarael on Jul 3, 2007 at 9:32 PM PDT
In the book, ‘‘The Mutant Message Down Under”, the aborigines of Austrailia say that the only reason to take the life of an animal is for sheer survival under extreme situations. They’ve been forced off of their homelands, areas abundant with vegetation, (presumably so that condo’s can be erected by meat-eaters with no relationship to the land they’ve occupied) and are now forced to survive in unfertile regions where killing animals is the only stable source of nutrition.
As American’s, we have the best nutrition on the planet, in an abundance of options other than animal products, available to us every day. What is not so available is the awareness that our ignorance and disrespect and basic blood lust causes pain and suffering and bad health to the animals eaten. In fact, I’ve heard industry representatives refer to the animals as products. How is that for demonstrated insensativity? Aside from the fact that it’s poor behavior to cause senseless suffering, it affects our own health as well as our concsiousness.
Even if allowances are made for people’s mistaken belief that they require meat, there is no excuse for the inhumane management practices. Chickens, or any animals, do not belong in cages, they belong in open, organic grassland. We do not need to eat meat every day, under any circumstance and this hugely wasteful, mass-production has got to stop, and now.
4. by Holly on Jul 5, 2007 at 6:54 AM PDT
I just have a problem with the either-or mentality. Rather than pushing the “meat-is-murder” argument, I think all this energy would be better served convincing those of us with choices to eat naturally and humainly-raised animals (better for us, them, and the environment), and to eat less and waste less of all food sources.
5. by Holly on Jul 5, 2007 at 7:06 AM PDT
On second thought, I should’ve said the goal should be to make more options available--for healthy, environmentally-sustainable whole foods--available to more people. This includes buying locally, buying seasonally, supporting community gardens and organic farmers, buying only what you need and not wasting food. That way it’s not just about convincing the people who are Just Like You to believe Just Like You do; it’s about bettering everybody’s situation.
6. by Fiksu on Jul 7, 2007 at 2:13 PM PDT
I’m all about the dairy and the eggs. (Local, organic, humanely raised, all that, but yep, I love animal products.)
But my son is allergic to eggs and I’m so grateful for the work vegans -- especially Moskowitz -- have done in figuring out how to bake without them. Love the vegan cupcakes!
7. by viv on Jan 5, 2008 at 2:25 PM PST
I was fine with my SPCA approved free range eggs until I found out 200 million male chicks a year are thrown alive in a grinder or gassed under the free range plan. It doesn’t bother Bourdain, and that’s his business, but it bothers me. Short of going to the woman up the road who has a dozen chickens, I’m not touching eggs.
(The elitism thing in another comment is odd to me since it takes 10 pounds of veg. to get 1 pound of meat to the table.)
8. by TRISTA on Jun 29, 2010 at 10:20 AM PDT
I ate animals for most of my life, and I’ve always loved food. However, I never ate meals as savory and satisfying as I do now that I live a vegan lifestyle. I think a plant-based diet offers eaters soul-satisfying flavors, and that’s reason enough to go vegan.
9. by jillblevins on Dec 1, 2010 at 2:05 PM PST
Oh I have my boxing gloves on now, ready to back you up, excited to be on your side, and happy to have people like you to follow down the path.
That’s how change is made: one person who won’t back down, inspiring a few others who, in turn, inspire more and more.
There are more “mostly” vegans around than most people notice. You find them at Thanksgiving, like I did, politely turning down the turkey and not making a big deal about it.
10. by ANDREA on Jan 26, 2011 at 10:56 PM PST
Although not famous like Anthony Bourdain, I too am a classically trained chef who understands the philosophy that “fat is flavor” and fine skills in the preparation of exotics such offal and blood sausage are revered in the culinary world. However, the ability to coach the subtle earthy sweetness from a perfectly roasted turnip, adroitly layer the the complex flavors of an exotically spiced pumpkin tagine or simply roast the pick of the farmers’ market summer vegetables for the quintessential piquant panini requires the tightly honed skills of the most adept chef (something that has escaped Bourdain, despite his many opportunities to be exposed to great plant-based cuisine).
I believe that those of us who have taken the challenge of progressing, despite the boisterous disparaging outbursts of populist, if misguided, public figures must continue to share our message of the benefits of a whole foods plant-based diet and share it deliciously. Through food we express or culture, our passion and our love of family and friends. Throughout most of history, prior to the second half of the 20th Century, most of the world’s diet was primarily plant dependent, so really we are returning to our roots by returning to a plant-based diet succulently rich in texture, heat, flavor, spice and scent.
The adage, “Be the change you wish to see in the world,” truly applies here; being forceful is not so important as being an example. I truly appreciate Moskowitz’s example.
Add a comment